Why ain't JAR on Insomniac?

[Boulevard of Brexit Dreams]

It seems strange to release JAR only 2 months before Insomniac, but not include JAR on Insomniac 

[Spoopy Doo]

My guess is that it didn't fit in with the mood of the rest of the album. Insomniac is fairly consistently angry/pissed off throughout, whereas J.A.R., while heavy in subject matter, is more sad/reflective than angry. Quality-wise, however, it definitely deserved a spot on the album

[pouty bitch]

20 minutes ago, Spoopy Doo said:

My guess is that it didn't fit in with the mood of the rest of the album. Insomniac is fairly consistently angry/pissed off throughout, whereas J.A.R., while heavy in subject matter, is more sad/reflective than angry. Quality-wise, however, it definitely deserved a spot on the album

You've hit the nail on the head there. That is a perfect explanation. 

[Mega Man]

J.A.R. was a Dookie song that was shelved. It was never on the table for Insomniac, despite how close the albums sound production-wise. As I recall, J.A.R. was released without the band's consent, which caused a rift with their management. Though it did get them another hot single in the interim.

[Spoopy Doo]

1 hour ago, Mega Man said:

J.A.R. was a Dookie song that was shelved. It was never on the table for Insomniac, despite how close the albums sound production-wise. As I recall, J.A.R. was released without the band's consent, which caused a rift with their management. Though it did get them another hot single in the interim.

International Superhits!'s liner notes seem to indicate that the recording of the song on there is from the Insomniac sessions; Kevin Army is listed as having mixed the song, and while Insomniac has Army listed as the engineer and Jerry Finn as having mixed it, it is (as far as I know) the only album on which Army worked with the band. So it's not 100% confirmed, but signs seem to point that this take of the song was recorded somewhere around the time that Insomniac was.

[Mega Man]

Had to look back at a few magazines and books to jog my memory.

I got a few details wrong, J.A.R. was allegedly leaked to KROQ in July before its intended release by managers Elliot Cahn and Jeff Saltzman. Though sources seem to indicate it was recorded specifically for the Angus soundtrack and at no point intended for Insomniac (despite being demoed for Dookie). You're right, the final version was definitely recorded during the Insomniac sessions.

[TimmyChunks]

Great question, thanks for revisiting an old topic as this is one of their best earlier songs in my opinion. I do remember that it was recorded during the Insomniac sessions. I actually can't cite any sources but I remember reading about a Warner/Reprise issue pledging this song for the Angus soundtrack which somewhat inadvertently prevented them from releasing it on Insomniac. I understand this type of dual release happens all the time but apparently there was some sort of legal conflict preventing the release on both albums. This is from memory though (and it was about 22 years ago) so I may be mistaken. I was pretty upset about it at the time as I had to deal with listening to the song on cassette for about 5 years and was pissed that they hadn't been able to fit it into the Insomniac cd for whatever reason. It would have been great sandwiched between Westbound Sign and Tightwad Hill. 

[Spoopy Doo]

5 hours ago, Mega Man said:

Had to look back at a few magazines and books to jog my memory.

I got a few details wrong, J.A.R. was allegedly leaked to KROQ in July before its intended release by managers Elliot Cahn and Jeff Saltzman. Though sources seem to indicate it was recorded specifically for the Angus soundtrack and at no point intended for Insomniac (despite being demoed for Dookie). You're right, the final version was definitely recorded during the Insomniac sessions.

That makes more sense. The overall sound is somewhat different from the rest of Insomniac, I'm just now realizing 

[Marki.]

I agree that it doesn't fit with the mood on Insomniac, it would stand out. This is really interesting to read though, thanks for bringing it up - I didn't know all this background info, even though it's one of my favourite songs ever.

[Todd]

I think it would fit great on Insomniac, just where @TimmyChunks said. Doesn't seem like it would stand out, albums are allowed to have songs with different themes and tones.
As these early Insomniac lists show though, JAR wasn't slated for the album

[AlissaGoesRAWR]

38 minutes ago, Todd said:

I think it would fit great on Insomniac, just where @TimmyChunks said. Doesn't seem like it would stand out, albums are allowed to have songs with different themes and tones.
As these early Insomniac lists show though, JAR wasn't slated for the album

I feel like I should know way more about this album than I do. "All Wound Up" is obviously "Bab's Uvula Who?" and I assume "Riot Song" is "Panic Song," but what are the songs "Insomniac" and whatever "Gett" is the beginning of?

[gnash]

I assume Insomniac is Brain Stew?

[nopride84]

From 1995 rolling Stone interview 

But as Green Day's world gets bigger and bigger, keeping control isn't always so simple. Last July, when a few radio stations, including KROQ, in Los Angeles, began broadcasting "J.A.R." – a song the band recorded for the soundtrack of a box-office bomb called Angus – weeks before it was scheduled for airplay, rumors began circulating that Green Day's managers, Elliot Cahn and Jeff Saltzman, were to blame. It was assumed that Cahn and Saltzman had proffered copies of "J.A.R." as an enticement for stations to play acts on (510) Records, a new label the managers had recently started with MCA. Saltzman contends that these rumors are false.

 

So apparently they recorded it for the movie

[Spoopy Doo]

3 hours ago, Todd said:

I think it would fit great on Insomniac, just where @TimmyChunks said. Doesn't seem like it would stand out, albums are allowed to have songs with different themes and tones.
As these early Insomniac lists show though, JAR wasn't slated for the album
 

I completely forgot about those lists 

[Todd]

3 hours ago, AlissaGoesRAWR said:

I feel like I should know way more about this album than I do. "All Wound Up" is obviously "Bab's Uvula Who?" and I assume "Riot Song" is "Panic Song," but what are the songs "Insomniac" and whatever "Gett" is the beginning of?

"Insomniac" is most likeley Brain Stew, "Alright" is Stuck With Me, and "Doo Da Da" is Do Da Da  Which brings into question the verity of the story about Do Da Da originally being titled "Stuck With Me", but the names were switched. 

The Insomniac session songs NOT shown on the list are J.A.R., which wouldn't have had a different title because you can hear Billie call it "Jar" on one of the Dookie demos, I Want to Be on TV, which also wouldn't have a different title because it's a Fang cover, then Don't Wanna Fall in Love and Rotting, but those both seem like obvious titles. So who knows what "Getting" or maybe "Getto" (You know Billie doesn't have the best spelling ) could be

[AlissaGoesRAWR]

5 minutes ago, Todd said:

"Insomniac" is most likeley Brain Stew, "Alright" is Stuck With Me, and "Doo Da Da" is Do Da Da  Which brings into question the verity of the story about Do Da Da originally being titled "Stuck With Me", but the names were switched. 

The Insomniac session songs NOT shown on the list are J.A.R., which wouldn't have had a different title because you can hear Billie call it "Jar" on one of the Dookie demos, I Want to Be on TV, which also wouldn't have a different title because it's a Fang cover, then Don't Wanna Fall in Love and Rotting, but those both seem like obvious titles. So who knows what "Getting" or maybe "Getto" (You know Billie doesn't have the best spelling ) could be

Yeah, after I posted I realized that Brain Stew was missing from the list and that being Insomniac made sense. But who knows what the mysterious "Gett" song is... reminds me of all of those trilogy songs that we saw referenced in Cuatro that will probably never see the light of day!

[Mega Man]

7 minutes ago, Todd said:

"Insomniac" is most likeley Brain Stew, "Alright" is Stuck With Me, and "Doo Da Da" is Do Da Da  Which brings into question the verity of the story about Do Da Da originally being titled "Stuck With Me", but the names were switched.

That's an interesting topic on its own. There's even multiple versions of the myth; one says that the song "I'm Alright" was given the name "Stuck With Me" by mistake (getting the name from the song now known as "Do Da Da"), and that "Do Da Da" was just a nonsense name given at the last minute. The other suggests that they both had the final names of "Do Da Da" and "Stuck With Me" and that they were literally switched when labeled on the master copies. To my knowledge the second story is the only one that made it to print in the form of Green Day - American Idiots & The New Punk Explosion. Still hardly definitive, though. Assuming "Alright" was soon changed to "Stuck With Me", the second variation is plausible. At least a switch in the names makes more sense than getting the name of an existing song out of nowhere.

[youngreendayvet]

Wasn't it ultimately released to support the movie Angus because Rob Cavallo produced that movie? I thought the same went for the Weezer song "You Gave Your Love to Me Softly" which is the one Weezer song Rob produced.

[WhiteTim]

15 hours ago, youngreendayvet said:

Wasn't it ultimately released to support the movie Angus because Rob Cavallo produced that movie? I thought the same went for the Weezer song "You Gave Your Love to Me Softly" which is the one Weezer song Rob produced.

majority of this reason 

a small portion is cause Angus was released by the same label soundtrack producers like to use their labels artists due to much ease of getting clearances to use the band/songs when a band or artist appears on another labels project not only do the artists get paid on their own the label has to pay the guest artists label for clearances so if a soundtrack comes out on Reprise then Reprise only has to pay for the non Reprise artists clearances 

[Insomniac186]

Hey guys, I actually came across the original trailer for Angus and this definitely doesn't sound like the final version of JAR. It sounds like the demo version to me.  Thoughts?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3f_aU8iTr4A

[17Gonzalo]

On 2017-4-8 at 11:02 PM, Mega Man said:

J.A.R. was a Dookie song that was shelved. It was never on the table for Insomniac, despite how close the albums sound production-wise. As I recall, J.A.R. was released without the band's consent, which caused a rift with their management. Though it did get them another hot single in the interim.

If you see the engineers of the recording of the song they are the same than Insomniac songs and different from dookie  ones. I hink that it was recorded during the Insomniac sessions

[GreenDayTheory]

On April 10, 2017 at 2:24 AM, AlissaGoesRAWR said:

Yeah, after I posted I realized that Brain Stew was missing from the list and that being Insomniac made sense. But who knows what the mysterious "Gett" song is... reminds me of all of those trilogy songs that we saw referenced in Cuatro that will probably never see the light of day!

The "Gett" song was probably retitled bucause i read somewhere everything on Insomniac was released 

[maseuz]

On 6/12/2017 at 7:08 AM, GreenDayTheory said:

The "Gett" song was probably retitled bucause i read somewhere everything on Insomniac was released 

On 4/9/2017 at 2:18 PM, Todd said:

"Insomniac" is most likeley Brain Stew, "Alright" is Stuck With Me, and "Doo Da Da" is Do Da Da  Which brings into question the verity of the story about Do Da Da originally being titled "Stuck With Me", but the names were switched. 

The Insomniac session songs NOT shown on the list are J.A.R., which wouldn't have had a different title because you can hear Billie call it "Jar" on one of the Dookie demos, I Want to Be on TV, which also wouldn't have a different title because it's a Fang cover, then Don't Wanna Fall in Love and Rotting, but those both seem like obvious titles. So who knows what "Getting" or maybe "Getto" (You know Billie doesn't have the best spelling ) could be

I think "Gett-" might be Suffocate. I know it was a Warning Nimrod b-side but hear me out. The line "make it stop, I'm getting off" is repeated throughout the song so maybe it was originally titled "Getting Off." as for the song being recorded/released 5 2 years later, it was the same deal for Haushinka and even more so for When It's Time, so I think it's plausible.

[WhiteTim]

1 hour ago, maseuz said:

I think "Gett-" might be Suffocate. I know it was a Warning b-side but hear me out. The line "make it stop, I'm getting off" is repeated throughout the song so maybe it was originally titled "Getting Off." as for the song being recorded/released 5 years later, it was the same deal for Haushinka and even more so for When It's Time, so I think it's plausible.

Suffocate actually was released in 1997 so only 2 years later it was on the AUS edition of Nimrod (along with You Lied Desensitized and Do Da Da) it’s also the b side of the single for Hitchin A Ride or Good Riddance (forget which one I’m sure @Todd would know exact one) 

[maseuz]

10 minutes ago, WhiteTim said:

Suffocate actually was released in 1997 so only 2 years later it was on the AUS edition of Nimrod (along with You Lied Desensitized and Do Da Da) it’s also the b side of the single for Hitchin A Ride or Good Riddance (forget which one I’m sure @Todd would know exact one) 

Wow, so even closer after than I thought! also I believe it was released again in 1998 on the Good Riddance single. sorry about that mess-up on the date before

Edit: the b-sides for Hitchin were Sick and Espionage