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Green Day as musicians.


Vic_Rattlehead

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On ASCAP, only Billie, Mike, and Tré are credited for writing the new songs. Jason apparently didn't have any part in writing the songs on the trilogy - at least, not significant enough for him to be listed as a songwriter. (And the band or their manager has to register the songs on ASCAP, so the credits should be 100% accurate.) So I think Billie came up with them.

ASCAP is just a way to organize the royalties, it's more just business. The people credited are the people who are to be paid but not necessarily the actual writers of the songs. With most bands, the royalties are split like this: Songwriter - 75% of royalties, the band - splits 25% of royalties.

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Just listen to their songs. It's obvious that Green Day are amazing musicians. Don't even try to convince the public though. It's like trying to convince my friends that Payphone really isn't the most meaningful song ever. :P

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ASCAP is just a way to organize the royalties, it's more just business. The people credited are the people who are to be paid but not necessarily the actual writers of the songs. With most bands, the royalties are split like this: Songwriter - 75% of royalties, the band - splits 25% of royalties.

Again like the nightlife debate I doubt Jason would be ok with writing parts and not A) be credited and B) not get paid for it...

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Again like the nightlife debate I doubt Jason would be ok with writing parts and not A) be credited and B) not get paid for it...

Is Jason credited for anything? I haven't seen yet.

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Is Jason credited for anything? I haven't seen yet.

No only Billie Mike and Tre except for Nightlife which is credited to Billie and Lady Cobra

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ASCAP is just a way to organize the royalties, it's more just business. The people credited are the people who are to be paid but not necessarily the actual writers of the songs. With most bands, the royalties are split like this: Songwriter - 75% of royalties, the band - splits 25% of royalties.

Obviously there's a difference between writing a song and playing it--particularly in the case of many pop acts who are singing songs written by other people and using studio musicians as backup on top of it--but Green Day does write their own songs, which is why they generally get credited for it. If you look on the liner notes for the albums, there are always two separate credits for lyrics and music. For the most part, it generally reads "Lyrics by Billie Joe Armstrong. Music by Green Day." This is because the entire group contributed to the writing of the instrumental aspects of the songs, even though only one or two people contributed to the lyrics for each track. Now, if you look at the ASCAP's listings, almost all of their songs are credited to all three members, not just Billie Joe or Mike or Tre for writing the lyrics, because they all had a hand in writing the piece, as a whole. Therefore, the fact that "Nightlife" does not feature Mike and Tre in the credits is actually significant.

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Green Day as musicians?

Billie - Interesting guitar player, competent on the rhythmn department but nothing outstanding. Can create awesome sugary hooks and riffs, but his ability is nothing outstanding. No the best in rock and punk.

Mike - Preety good bass player, very underrated, the most technically gifted musician in the band. His awesome bass fills are a punk/rock bass player's dream. Still, not the best on rock/punk.

Tre - Very standard drummer with an amazing timekeeping ability. Not the best on rock and punk, like the others.

Why are Green Day one of the best bands around when the musicians are not (by a long shot) the best? Because they can create good songs, with riffs that you can sing to and an amazing chemistry.

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On an album liner notes it can be listed however they want it to be

On the ascap they list all on same application

Example (just an example )

Say for Stray Heart

It'd have

Billie Joe Armstrong

lyrics 25%

Music 25%

Mike Dirnt

Lyrics 0%

Music 25%

Tre Cool

lyrics 0%

Music 25%

So for every time the song is played royalties is paid to each member so Billie would recieve 50% and Mike and Tre would each get 25% of the royalties

If you're not on ascap or bmi you only get paid once (usually at a cheap price) as a work for hire so a band could make millions on a song and the work for hire gets maybe 5k on a song which is why most people arent so willing to pass up on being credited...

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i don't think they're that technical in their playing abilities but i do think they have a lot of character which in my opinion can be better id much rather listen to green day then a very technical band such as dream theatre

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ASCAP is just a way to organize the royalties, it's more just business. The people credited are the people who are to be paid but not necessarily the actual writers of the songs. With most bands, the royalties are split like this: Songwriter - 75% of royalties, the band - splits 25% of royalties.

Actually, the people credited on ASCAP *are* the writers of the songs. It doesn't distinguish between who wrote lyrics or music - anyone listed my have written lyrics, music, or both. But if they're listed, they *did* help write the song, and if anyone is not listed, it's because they did *not* have a part in writing the song.

ASCAP needs to have accurate information on who wrote the song as well as who performed it, as the royalties earned on a given song have to be divided up between the writers and the performers (even if they are the same people). Generally the writers get half and the performers get half. (Of course, this doesn't take into account all of the extra percentages that have to go to the label and various other people who had any part at all in the creation/distribution of a song. But I'm not going to get into that right now.)

But yeah, the listed writers on ASCAP are the true authors of the song and the only authors of that song.

(Unless someone made some small change, but it was tiny enough that they chose not to be credited. This has happened in some cases, but it's the decision of that individual who is opting not to be credited.)

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I know their songs aren't so complicated from the point of view of the music, but I think that their content of the songs are really special and beautiful and that's what really matters in my opinion

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On an album liner notes it can be listed however they want it to be

On the ascap they list all on same application

Example (just an example )

Say for Stray Heart

It'd have

Billie Joe Armstrong

lyrics 25%

Music 25%

Mike Dirnt

Lyrics 0%

Music 25%

Tre Cool

lyrics 0%

Music 25%

So for every time the song is played royalties is paid to each member so Billie would recieve 50% and Mike and Tre would each get 25% of the royalties

If you're not on ascap or bmi you only get paid once (usually at a cheap price) as a work for hire so a band could make millions on a song and the work for hire gets maybe 5k on a song which is why most people arent so willing to pass up on being credited...

Haven't the band said numerous times that they split their pay equally? That even though Billie writes the lyrics, they divide all the money by 3?

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Haven't the band said numerous times that they split their pay equally? That even though Billie writes the lyrics, they divide all the money by 3?

Thats why I said it was just an example the bands/artists make their splits not ascap they can have it as the example or all even

The example was simply given to give people who may not know how ASCAP works

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Haven't the band said numerous times that they split their pay equally? That even though Billie writes the lyrics, they divide all the money by 3?

Like WhiteTim said, bands have the right to decide how much each band member earns. They can choose if one member gets 50% and the other 3 share the remaining 50%, or they can decide they all get an equal share (which I think is what Green Day has decided to do), etc. The band can also decide if any one band member has more power when it comes to making decisions about what the band does (like where they tour for example), or who (if anyone) can use their band name in the case that they break up or any member(s) leave. It's all contractual stuff that usually should be decided when the band begins their career. But of course they can make changes to it afterwards.

But standard procedure is writers earn half of the royalties and performers earn half (minus money that goes to the label, etc.). Since Green Day are both the writers and the performers, they get the full amount (again, minus money that goes to other parties involved in their song).

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Actually, the people credited on ASCAP *are* the writers of the songs. It doesn't distinguish between who wrote lyrics or music - anyone listed my have written lyrics, music, or both. But if they're listed, they *did* help write the song, and if anyone is not listed, it's because they did *not* have a part in writing the song.

ASCAP needs to have accurate information on who wrote the song as well as who performed it, as the royalties earned on a given song have to be divided up between the writers and the performers (even if they are the same people). Generally the writers get half and the performers get half. (Of course, this doesn't take into account all of the extra percentages that have to go to the label and various other people who had any part at all in the creation/distribution of a song. But I'm not going to get into that right now.)

But yeah, the listed writers on ASCAP are the true authors of the song and the only authors of that song.

(Unless someone made some small change, but it was tiny enough that they chose not to be credited. This has happened in some cases, but it's the decision of that individual who is opting not to be credited.)

There's no way to really know who did what. By reading what's on ASCAP we only know whose getting a cut of the royalties. For example, that Elvis song "Heartbreak Hotel" was written by his friend Tommy Durden, but he only agreed to use this song if he was credited as a writer. So now now Elvis is credited for writing something he didn't take part in at all. Of course this scenario doesn't really fit Green Day's situation, it's just an example of how the true credit system can be interfered with the business side of things. I mean, this topic varies so much from band to band, writer to writer, it's hard to have a right answer.

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There's no way to really know who did what. By reading what's on ASCAP we only know whose getting a cut of the royalties. For example, that Elvis song "Heartbreak Hotel" was written by his friend Tommy Durden, but he only agreed to use this song if he was credited as a writer. So now now Elvis is credited for writing something he didn't take part in at all. Of course this scenario doesn't really fit Green Day's situation, it's just an example of how the true credit system can be interfered with the business side of things. I mean, this topic varies so much from band to band, writer to writer, it's hard to have a right answer.

But 99% of the time it should be totally accurate. The artist or their manager has to register the songs on ASCAP, and they have to provide all necessary information, including who the songwriters are. Generally - just about always - they will be honest about that. Everyone who had a part wants to be credited for their contribution, and people who didn't help don't really deserve a share, and the other writers wouldn't like that since that lessens the money they earn. Obviously people can and do include people that didn't really help write the song, or not include people who did, but normally they'll provide correct information.

In Green Day's case, I'm sure they want to be fair, so I don't see why they would give ASCAP false information.

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I don't think they get enough recognition in that vein. I feel like Billie has really improved as a guitarist over the years, yet no one really points it out and Mike is an awesome bassist and has come up with the sickest bass lines ever heard in music and he gets just about 0 credit for anything when it comes to press. Also, whenever someone does talk about Billie's vocals it's always how he does a fake British accent and how it makes he an ass or something (I've actually read that before) and sure maybe he doesn't have the best voice out, but I think it's unique. It's one of those voices that when you hear it without even seeing him you know it's him right away. And after listening to UNO it seems like his vocals have even improved.

I'm from the UK, and it never occurred to me he was putting on a British Accent at all, I know he says he does, so he must think so. I'm not overly keen on very strong English or American accents anyway, so the fact that he has managed to neutralize (if there was ever anything to neutralize in the first place, as his speaking voice/accent is also very nice) most if not all of his accent, I find that interesting, and I don't think it is an easy task.

And I would disagree with you about him not having 'the best voice out', I think he does, and that is one of the main reasons I became a Green Day fan. Their older stuff, his voice was not very good at all, but it's been getting better and better with every album, I think this is especially noticeable on the trilogy.

I can't comment really on their ability to play their instruments, as I don't have the know how for that, but as far as I am concerned they play great, and they work together really well, having been together for so long, and they write good songs/music, so it doesn't really matter. People go on about Jimmi Hendrix, personally I would much rather watch/listen to Green Day or nothing at all if he was the only other option.

I feel like they're a bit underrated as musicians. They are definitely not average musicians, they're extremely good musicians. That's pretty subjective though. If you think talent is just solos upon solos upon solos, then you probably won't think they're very talented. A lot of people have talked about musicianship and I agree - I think that's why Green Day work so well. High levels of talent + an understanding of music/their abilities = great, quality songs.

For the record, I feel like the most underrated part of Green Day is Billie's vocals.

All of this.

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Green Day as musicians .....

I think they are all very underrated by people who don't like the band or aren't big fans, i think people just see them as a Punk/rock band who just play a few power chords stick some root notes in on the bass and tre just drums..... But no

Billie is a great guitarist and an amazing songwriter! Mike is a great bass player he writes interesting bass more than just root notes! and Tre is very tight on the drums and puts in a lot of interesting fill etc!

But i think what really makes Green Day great musicians is that they work well together and that they are truly great friends.... their chemistry is what makes them the amazing band/performers and musicians they are!

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There's no way to really know who did what. By reading what's on ASCAP we only know whose getting a cut of the royalties. For example, that Elvis song "Heartbreak Hotel" was written by his friend Tommy Durden, but he only agreed to use this song if he was credited as a writer. So now now Elvis is credited for writing something he didn't take part in at all. Of course this scenario doesn't really fit Green Day's situation, it's just an example of how the true credit system can be interfered with the business side of things. I mean, this topic varies so much from band to band, writer to writer, it's hard to have a right answer.

oh my god. are you saying that Billie isn't the songrwiter now, too? He definitely is the songwriter

the stupidity of some of you makes me sad

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I'm from the UK, and it never occurred to me he was putting on a British Accent at all, I know he says he does, so he must think so. I'm not overly keen on very strong English or American accents anyway, so the fact that he has managed to neutralize (if there was ever anything to neutralize in the first place, as his speaking voice/accent is also very nice) most if not all of his accent, I find that interesting, and I don't think it is an easy task.

And I would disagree with you about him not having 'the best voice out', I think he does, and that is one of the main reasons I became a Green Day fan. Their older stuff, his voice was not very good at all, but it's been getting better and better with every album, I think this is especially noticeable on the trilogy.

I can't comment really on their ability to play their instruments, as I don't have the know how for that, but as far as I am concerned they play great, and they work together really well, having been together for so long, and they write good songs/music, so it doesn't really matter. People go on about Jimmi Hendrix, personally I would much rather watch/listen to Green Day or nothing at all if he was the only other option.

What I meant by not the best voice out there is that he's not classically trained or anything you know. I personally love his voice and I think it's great but I don't think it's any recognition because it doesn't sound like it's Michael Buble or someone like that. I wasn't trying to say his voice is awful! Sorry for the misunderstanding! I just meant others might not like his voice because it's not....fancy...I can't find the proper word sorry :lol:

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I think what is not really underrated by fans, but perhaps a little bit by people on the outside, is the band's technical skill and diversity. It's not just 3 chords. With that said, don't overestimate their abilities either. They are pretty average for proffesional musicians with 25 years in the business. We all go nuts when Billie pulls out one of his solos. Yes, they sound amazing, yes they have character, but no, they are not really that complex. He's a pretty good guitarist and vocalist, but you are expected to after 25 years. Billie Joe's vocal abilities has never been amazing, not even if he were in a broadway musical, but best of all he has a voice with character. I think what is Green Day's and especially Billie Joe's biggest advantage is the musical nerve; their sense of groove and writing, and their character which always shines through. I personally find the whole deal with overly skilled guitarists boring anyway...

Let's just say I think they wouldn't make it far in a competition based on skill, with all the other biggest musicians in the world

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Billie's guitar skills are very unnoticed since the mainstream shit didn't have awesome solos like 1039 or Kerplunk has, but it's showing in the Trilogy and it's surely shocking people over at Ultimate Guitar, haha. Mike and Tre make a perfect rhythm section. Jason is a great addition too, he's guitar playing is VERY smooth. Put all four together, it's orgasm at first note.

Yeah, because I'm sure they could do a reasonable version of Master of Puppets, Billie's played the riff at gigs before :P

They'll come out with a 5 second studio video of Master of Puppets soon. Just like Hybrid Moments.

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But 99% of the time it should be totally accurate. The artist or their manager has to register the songs on ASCAP, and they have to provide all necessary information, including who the songwriters are. Generally - just about always - they will be honest about that. Everyone who had a part wants to be credited for their contribution, and people who didn't help don't really deserve a share, and the other writers wouldn't like that since that lessens the money they earn. Obviously people can and do include people that didn't really help write the song, or not include people who did, but normally they'll provide correct information.

In Green Day's case, I'm sure they want to be fair, so I don't see why they would give ASCAP false information.

That's right. I'm actually a part of SOCAN, which is the same idea, just Canadian. You provide all the information, like who wrote what, who played what, and whose paid what. Some people seem to be rethinking their royalty split rate because of a new "performance" royalty that was just recently added. I don't mean the royalty category that goes along with mechanical, synchronization, etc.. but a new, specifically for who performed on the recording. SOCAN, BMI, ASCAP, and all the others automatically began to pay it out. It can eliminate a lot of the royalty split problems I suppose. I'm sure you're right about Green Day. I mean they're such a tight unit that if someone contributes a bass line, drum beat, or even an rearrange to a song, Billie Joe will give the person a credit, which the songwriter doesn't necessarily have to do.

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