ChelseaDagger Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 I'm not sure if this is topic-worthy, but do you guys feel that Green Day get enough respect for their instrumental/vocal ability? I personally don't, as people tend to focus on their songwriting and lyrics rather than musicianship. I don't have anything really to add to this conversation, but I definitely agree with you.... the musicianship is overlooked. But they have all our respect that's for damn sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SetOnOverdrive Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 There's a reason Green Day are nominated for Best Live band year after year in so many different award ceremonies. These guys are fucking tight when they play live. Not just the free of them but Jason White and Freese (and the other dude who is so insignificant I forget his name). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schlappy Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Tre holds back for some reason. He may be, as Billie calls him, "the best drummer in rock and roll", but he doesn't show it. His fills sound great, but you guys would be surprised at how much he does the same one. I really wish i could remember where but i read an article where Tre talked about how his job is to hold the band together and something along the lines of he wants the band to sound good and crazy drum solos just fuck up the music. He talked like it wasnt about showing off but that he has a job to do (probably the most important one) and he makes sure he does it damn well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain peroxide Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 fucking shred Heh, not quite. But it is good to hear more intricate solos coming from him, I'll agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schlappy Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 The thing is, I'm still not sure how many of those he even wrote. Jason is a much better guitarist, it's likely he wrote and played at least some of them. i'm preeety sure Billie wrote them... I remember him mentioning that he was trying to tighten up his solo chops again and mike was really encouraging him to do so. I dont really think Jason was there for the writing process, just recording. And i think he only recorded second guitar not the solos, according to an interview with Billie. thats my evidence for it but i guess we'll have to wait for the DVD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Rhyme Or Reason Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 The thing is, I'm still not sure how many of those he even wrote. Jason is a much better guitarist, it's likely he wrote and played at least some of them. At least on 1039 Billie played everything. On ASCAP, only Billie, Mike, and Tré are credited for writing the new songs. Jason apparently didn't have any part in writing the songs on the trilogy - at least, not significant enough for him to be listed as a songwriter. (And the band or their manager has to register the songs on ASCAP, so the credits should be 100% accurate.) So I think Billie came up with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerardsangel4977 Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 The lyrics also up until American Idiot are a huge reason of why they are so successful, they speak to a lot of people, particularly angsty teens (speaking as a former angsty teen). Did you seriously just imply that American Idiot doesn't have lyrics that speak to people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 On ASCAP, only Billie, Mike, and Tré are credited for writing the new songs. Jason apparently didn't have any part in writing the songs on the trilogy - at least, not significant enough for him to be listed as a songwriter. (And the band or their manager has to register the songs on ASCAP, so the credits should be 100% accurate.) So I think Billie came up with them. i'm preeety sure Billie wrote them... I remember him mentioning that he was trying to tighten up his solo chops again and mike was really encouraging him to do so. I dont really think Jason was there for the writing process, just recording. And i think he only recorded second guitar not the solos, according to an interview with Billie. thats my evidence for it but i guess we'll have to wait for the DVD! Fair enough then. Still, I think 1039 is Billie's best guitar album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerardsangel4977 Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 i agree, i dont listen to slappy much because his voice really annoys me tbh. but now if Billie sang the friken phone book id have wet panties yeah yeah dry ice i know, but that was a long time ago. I'm not saying he's bad! i just want him to show me, y'know? when i heard the first few solos on the trilogy sweet jesus it was a miracle. You know, there's this marvelous invention called youtube where you can actually watch him playing.... The thing is, I'm still not sure how many of those he even wrote. Jason is a much better guitarist, it's likely he wrote and played at least some of them. At least on 1039 Billie played everything. Others beat me to this but, in the Guitar World interview, it was mentioned flat-out that Billie was the one playing the solos, which is likewise evident in the live shots of those songs. And there is certainly no doubt in my mind that he wrote them, as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 I hate people who call Billie a "bad" guitar player. He's obviously NOT bad. He can play... really good actually. Just look at songs from their first records. Im glad that on this tour, Billie seems to be playing lead guitar in most songs again.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeysturkeyhead Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Agreed some of his old riffs and fills were just awesome, i mean Jesus Of Suburbia bass solo compare that do say Stuck With Me. What happened..... I'm gonna tell you what happened, as Rob and Mike said in an interview that it was part of the sound, it wasn't supposed to be any stunning basslines in American Idiot or 21st Century Breakdown, they were heading for a deeper bass sound in those albums. It's not like he couldn't make basslines anymore, trust me, he can do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frunsi Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 i don't think green day are superb musicians. they do have some talent and they play really tight live, but i don't think their music is too hard to play. i know loads of bands who a) have better guitarists who pull off badass riffs and amazingly fast solos (makeout party isn't really that mindblowing) b) have bass players that play tighter and faster than mike and also compose actual riffs instead of just doing fills and c) have drummers that have faster hands, do more creative beats and better fills. hell, even in punk rock their musicianship is average at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pucky Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 For those of you saying that Tré is not playing 100% of his capacity in the last records...I think he is not holding back, maybe you have to consider that he is 39 now. I would say that it's natural that he can't be such a beast at the drums at the current age. He is not 20 anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 I'm gonna tell you what happened, as Rob and Mike said in an interview that it was part of the sound, it wasn't supposed to be any stunning basslines in American Idiot or 21st Century Breakdown, they were heading for a deeper bass sound in those albums. It's not like he couldn't make basslines anymore, trust me, he can do that. I'm not saying that he can't do them, i just wish they were more prominent in the newer songs. How many people would love to hear a song with a bass line like When I Come Around again....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InvaderPhantom Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Green Day's rythm section is waaaay underrated. At least the one from the 90s. I play bass myself and playing Mike's bass lines on American Idiot, 21st Century Breakdown and most of the trilogy is pretty easy, but the stuff he plays on Kerplunk, Dookie and Insomniac is very difficult to play. Especially Insomniac is pretty crazy. I think it's kinda sad that Mike's bass lines got so simple since AI, I mean what happened? You can't lose a talent just like that. But his bass lines got better with Uno and Dos, the bass breakdown in Makeout Party is delicious. But still, back then Mike's bass harmonied so perfectly with what Billie played on his guitar, it was a such special sound. Mike is such a talent bassist, he should really show it more. After all, with Longview he wrote one of the most memorable (and difficult to play) bass lines in rock. He even used to slap, like in 16 and Who Wrote Holden Caulfield... Tré is also a very underrated drummer - I think he actually kinda stands in the shadow of Travis Barker who is of course one of the most talented drummers ever, so people often compare Tré and Travis because Green Day and Blink are like... band cousins or something. But Tré is a great drummer in another way. In a more rock'n'roll way. People love Travis because he's fast as hell, experimental and looks badass while playing, but Tré ROCKS and some of his stuff is complicated as hell. The drum breakdown in Burnout blows my mind every time, especially when they play it live - Tré nails it every time. Billie is one of the best live singers in rock right now, no doubt about that. Listen to the "no one really seems to caaaare" part in Jesus of Suburbia on the Awesome As Fuck DVD. Amazing! His guitar solos sound badass, but they are very similar if you listen closely, especially the improvised ones like when they play American Idiot live. But he isn't the greatest guitarist ever, it's mostly three chord punk rock after all. Oh yeah, last thing: Mike's harmony vocals! The On the Radio version of Words I Might Have Ate gives me goose-bumps every time. Other beautiful examples are Boulevard of Broken Dreams, Having a Blast, Stay the Night, She, 21st Century Breakdown, Holiday, See You Tonight and many more... I actually can't think of any other punk rock band that has such great harmony back vocals. After all these years he managed to sound very similar to Billie. When I listened to the 21stCB album I was actually afraid that Billie did his own backing vocals throughout the album, but after listening to the instrumental versions you can tell it's Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schlappy Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 You know, there's this marvelous invention called youtube where you can actually watch him playing.... nooo way what!?! yeah, i lot of the old videos are too crappy for my viewing pleasure. Except for that footage form their high school, that stuff is sick. i think i did a crappy job of explaining what i am trying to say over this conversation. In short i think is solos during AI and 21CB tours were kinda bad, but i'm excited to see the new solos live Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeysturkeyhead Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Mike Dirnt is the most unrecognized bassist around. Insomniac is a bass player's dream. Damn Right, he's the best bassist ever. imo Damn right it is a dream :') Mike is such a talent bassist, he should really show it more. After all, with Longview he wrote one of the most memorable (and difficult to play) bass lines in rock. Longview isn't very difficult, it's on of the first songs I learned on bass, No One knows on the other hand, talk about killing your fingers, that's what I call difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blond-O-Sonic Shimmer Trap Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Did you seriously just imply that American Idiot doesn't have lyrics that speak to people? Up to and including! "Count up to ten" means up to and including ten! Yes, American Idiot is his lyrical masterpiece. It still astonishes me that they pulled off an album with a story, with such a vivid atmosphere. It's hugely underrated by a lot of critics who only see the "political" side which is at most two songs. Just the last two albums have been more about the overall feel of the song than particularly sharp lines and 21st Century Breakdown was a horrible mess of muddled similes that even he couldn't tell you what he was aiming for. Damn Right, he's the best bassist ever. imo Em.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 American Idiot is his lyrical masterpiece. I always felt Whatsername was one of the best songs lyrically on the album Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blond-O-Sonic Shimmer Trap Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 I always felt Whatsername was one of the best songs lyrically on the album Definitely, one of my favourite Green Day songs. But that, Letterbomb, Boulevard Of Broken Dreams, Holiday, St. Jimmy, Homecoming, all of them really. The only one that's a bit average lyrically is Extraordinary Girl as they became the millonth band to rhyme "girl" with "world" but I do like the line at the end "now that they've pulled the funding". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drankolz Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Green Day's rythm section is waaaay underrated. At least the one from the 90s. I play bass myself and playing Mike's bass lines on American Idiot, 21st Century Breakdown and most of the trilogy is pretty easy, but the stuff he plays on Kerplunk, Dookie and Insomniac is very difficult to play. Especially Insomniac is pretty crazy. I think it's kinda sad that Mike's bass lines got so simple since AI, I mean what happened? You can't lose a talent just like that. But his bass lines got better with Uno and Dos, the bass breakdown in Makeout Party is delicious. But still, back then Mike's bass harmonied so perfectly with what Billie played on his guitar, it was a such special sound. Mike is such a talent bassist, he should really show it more. After all, with Longview he wrote one of the most memorable (and difficult to play) bass lines in rock. He even used to slap, like in 16 and Who Wrote Holden Caulfield... Tré is also a very underrated drummer - I think he actually kinda stands in the shadow of Travis Barker who is of course one of the most talented drummers ever, so people often compare Tré and Travis because Green Day and Blink are like... band cousins or something. But Tré is a great drummer in another way. In a more rock'n'roll way. People love Travis because he's fast as hell, experimental and looks badass while playing, but Tré ROCKS and some of his stuff is complicated as hell. The drum breakdown in Burnout blows my mind every time, especially when they play it live - Tré nails it every time. Billie is one of the best live singers in rock right now, no doubt about that. Listen to the "no one really seems to caaaare" part in Jesus of Suburbia on the Awesome As Fuck DVD. Amazing! His guitar solos sound badass, but they are very similar if you listen closely, especially the improvised ones like when they play American Idiot live. But he isn't the greatest guitarist ever, it's mostly three chord punk rock after all. Oh yeah, last thing: Mike's harmony vocals! The On the Radio version of Words I Might Have Ate gives me goose-bumps every time. Other beautiful examples are Boulevard of Broken Dreams, Having a Blast, Stay the Night, She, 21st Century Breakdown, Holiday, See You Tonight and many more... I actually can't think of any other punk rock band that has such great harmony back vocals. After all these years he managed to sound very similar to Billie. When I listened to the 21stCB album I was actually afraid that Billie did his own backing vocals throughout the album, but after listening to the instrumental versions you can tell it's Mike. I see a lot of people complain about Mikes Bass playing and the way it evolved on and since American Idiot, I just picked your comment for no real reason . Consider some stuff: - On American Idiot, the band started to really write and construct songs with two or three guitar tracks and piano on top, and what Mike used to do on earlier records was great stuff, but it just wouldn't fit AI Era Songs. On earlier albums, there was plenty of room left for the bass that had to be filled, while in AI it really has do be tight and a solid base for all the stuff thats going on. The same thing goes for Tré's drumming, American IDiot is F***ing tasteful, great drums, that's my opinion as a drummer. - The band is doing what really good MUSICIANS are expected to do, they have no desire to show of instrumental skills, its musicianship that counts. They play what the song needs to create the perfect feeling, the perfect sound, as opposed to many instrumentalists who try to show off as many abilities as possible as often as possible. That being said, they are all three amazing instrumentalists also, with talent and feeling and, they always know exactly what they're doing. And one thing that differs their playing from many others: They have a unique style. - When playing old songs, they sound even better than they used to. Their sound evolved, they got better at their instruments, they know what's important, they have a good sound rather than just as loud as possible, what too many bands seem to think. They are incredibly good live, just watch how they interact on stage, its their second nature. Yes, they are often underrated. But, let me quote Tré here, it's always good to have more weapons to pull out. One other big aspect of their sound are the incredibly good backing vocals. Mike nails them, and so do Jason and Jeff live. Very important for a bands sound, yet barely anyone seems to notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooooooooooooom Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Mike, in particular, is massively underated. ridiculously good tone to his playing and some of the fills are nothing short of perfect. also, think the whole band's very underated in terms of how many songs they remember.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Lights Flash Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Some of you are mixing up the words "good" and "difficult". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Rhyme Or Reason Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Definitely, one of my favourite Green Day songs. But that, Letterbomb, Boulevard Of Broken Dreams, Holiday, St. Jimmy, Homecoming, all of them really. The only one that's a bit average lyrically is Extraordinary Girl as they became the millonth band to rhyme "girl" with "world" but I do like the line at the end "now that they've pulled the funding". Don't you mean.... "now that they both are finding"? Because that's how it goes. Extraordinary Girl is possibly my favorite song on AI - largely because of the lyrics. But whatever, to each their own. Up to and including! "Count up to ten" means up to and including ten! Yes, American Idiot is his lyrical masterpiece. It still astonishes me that they pulled off an album with a story, with such a vivid atmosphere. It's hugely underrated by a lot of critics who only see the "political" side which is at most two songs. Just the last two albums have been more about the overall feel of the song than particularly sharp lines and 21st Century Breakdown was a horrible mess of muddled similes that even he couldn't tell you what he was aiming for. I agree about American Idiot being a lyrical masterpiece and being underrated - also, I could never understand the obsession with the idea that it's SO political. Only 2 songs really are. The album is more like a personal journey. It's way more personal and about growing up and love and everything. I don't know how people missed that. It's a beautiful representation of his life and an entire culture to an extent. However, I think 21st Century Breakdown is also a masterpiece, lyrically as well as musically. Billie had some really good lyrics on there. It's nice to hear him sing songs that are more poetic or abstract than what he usually does. ¡Uno! seems like an overall relatable album, ¡Dos! is likewise pretty personal beneath that fun veneer. I think Billie's just a consistently very talented lyricist. He can be simple or complex, but it almost always seems personal and profound yet easily accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh100_3 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I consider Billie hands down my greatest influence on Guitar (along with John Frusciante and Chris Cheney). The reason I love his playing more than those wankers like Steve Vai and that dude from Dream Theater is because he makes SONGS! Billie knows what a song needs and I love that he brought the Johnny Ramone "no bullshit buzzsaw" style of playing back to punk/rock n roll. Having said all that...I'm absolutely loving watching him rip up on the trilogy! Should shut up a lot of snobby musicians who say he can't play... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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