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Communism: Yay or Nay?

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#1
Vesper

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It is my understanding that up until the present day Communism as a form of political management and leadership has failed in every case it has been tried or tested. Often these experiments have led to genocide and war.

Do you believe communism can work? Why? How? What structure would need to exist?

Discuss.


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#2
Lindsay

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I believe Communism is a great idea written down on paper, but impossible to actually achieve in real life.

I merely never see a truly Communist state working because there's ALWAYS going to be people who want more of their "share" or who want to be in control, hence why most of the communist states we've seen have never worked out and have had more authoritarian governments emerge, shifting it slightly more right towards the Fascist side of the political spectrum. Plus, I just think having some form of higher power gives better structure to a country.

If this post is completely off let me know, I'm not fully intelligent in this subject, just merely intrigued to what other people's views are. :P
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#3
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I believe Communism is a great idea written down on paper, but impossible to actually achieve in real life.

Better post coming shortly... http://www.greendaycommunity.org/public/...


I have doubts about it, even when it's written on paper, even though theoretically it might initially sound alright. I do agree that it is also impossible to achieve.

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#4
Reagan

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Err..I'm gonna go with 'Nay' on this one.

#5
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Err..I'm gonna go with 'Nay' on this one.


Any reasoning on that declaration?

#6
Reagan

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Any reasoning on that declaration?


Communism could work for a little bit, I guess, but it won't work forever. And I also think communism can lead to dictatorships.

The IDEA of it could be a good thing to some people, but actually putting it into practice is kinda open to corruptness.
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#7
HeißblütigerPinguin

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Boy, that's a topic for John. The "communism" as you had in the Soviet Union was definetly a nay, but that's not really communism, at least not after Marxs.

What I always wondered, though: hypothetically Marx's thesis becomes true and the social system is communism. How would the economy look like? Planned economy sure as hell ain't gonna work out and capitalism in its purest form would be kinda counterproductive
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#8
Reagan

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Boy, that's a topic for John.


That is the first thing I thought when I decided to look at this thread.

#9
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That is the first thing I thought when I decided to look at this thread.

me too. I remember the Presidential election thread that went down to the basics. Billy the capitalist against John the marxist, very fun to read!

#10
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Communism could work for a little bit, I guess, but it won't work forever. And I also think communism can lead to dictatorships.

The IDEA of it could be a good thing to some people, but actually putting it into practice is kinda open to corruptness.


I don't think it would work at all to be honest. Not communism in it's true form. I think there could be some form of pseudo-communism that might wobble along for a while, but eventually everyone would see it for the fallacy it was.

Boy, that's a topic for John. The "communism" as you had in the Soviet Union was definetly a nay, but that's not really communism, at least not after Marxs.

What I always wondered, though: hypothetically Marx's thesis becomes true and the social system is communism. How would the economy look like? Planned economy sure as hell ain't gonna work out and capitalism in its purest form would be kinda counterproductive


But Marx's ideas were never tried. I'm currently reading them as I write this and to be honest, a lot of it seems like a lot of hot air, emotional appeal and general jargon.

#11
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It is a great idea ... theoretically
you can't do it, it is impossibkle to work, but if it really worked... It'd be super

#12
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It is a great idea ... theoretically
you can't do it, it is impossibkle to work, but if it really worked... It'd be super


No it wouldn't. It would suck donkey testicles.
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#13
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I don't think it would work at all to be honest. Not communism in it's true form. I think there could be some form of pseudo-communism that might wobble along for a while, but eventually everyone would see it for the fallacy it was.


This is true, but like a poll I saw online, some guy said that it could work a little bit to "boot strap" a country. Then it would just go down the drain.

#14
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This is true, but like a poll I saw online, some guy said that it could work a little bit to "boot strap" a country. Then it would just go down the drain.


What do you mean by boot strap?

#15
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I don't think it would work at all to be honest. Not communism in it's true form. I think there could be some form of pseudo-communism that might wobble along for a while, but eventually everyone would see it for the fallacy it was.



But Marx's ideas were never tried. I'm currently reading them as I write this and to be honest, a lot of it seems like a lot of hot air, emotional appeal and general jargon.

I never read Marx we briefly discussed his theory when we were doing different social systems in social studies. Thing is you can't really "try" Marx. According to him it's a development that wouldn't work if someone wasn't ready and that's never going to happen

No it wouldn't. It would suck donkey testicles.

elaborate :)
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#16
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elaborate http://www.greendaycommunity.org/public/...


In terms of that fact that, no matter how you try to paint it, not everybody is born equal ("all animals are equal but some are more equal than others" :P) so therefore, if I'm a skilled doctor, I would find it intensely dissatisfactory to be on the same wage as a checkout girl/boy.

#17
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What do you mean by boot strap?

To bootstrap something means (well there's alot of different definitions but this is the one I found) Verb: 1. to undertake or accomplish something without minimal outside help Adj: 1.Being or relating to a process that is self-initiating or self sustaining You might need to look up the definition someplace other than the first website I found haha because you might get a better idea of what I meant by that.

Hahaha "all animals are equal but some are more equal than others" Animal Farm! I learned alot through that book. It puts communism into simple terms. I like simple terms.

Did you know (you probably did) that that book was based off of the communism in the Soviet Union? Each pig is a different figure in history.

#18
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So your basically saying that communism could be used to remove a country from the global markets and thus make it self-sustaining?

#19
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So your basically saying that communism could be used to remove a country from the global markets and thus make it self-sustaining?

that would make roussaue happy
well, if the people in it were it too

#20
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So your basically saying that communism could be used to remove a country from the global markets and thus make it self-sustaining?


Well, POSSIBLY. But like I said, it would definitely fall eventually, if not very quickly.

#21
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that would make roussaue happy
well, if the people in it were it too


Isn't rousseau's theory more about destroying what cannot be trusted? What's he got to do with it?

Hahaha "all animals are equal but some are more equal than others" Animal Farm! I learned alot through that book. It puts communism into simple terms. I like simple terms.

Did you know (you probably did) that that book was based off of the communism in the Soviet Union? Each pig is a different figure in history.


Yeah I did. :)

#22
Reagan

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Ps- We haven't gotten this far in Social Studies yet. Right now we're just working on the History of America, the civil war era. So that being said, I'm not sure who Marx or whoever this person is. So don't be surprised if I sound totally clueless on that subject. Anybody care to elaborate on who this guy is?

#23
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Ps- We haven't gotten this far in Social Studies yet. Right now we're just working on the History of America, the civil war era. So that being said, I'm not sure who Marx or whoever this person is. So don't be surprised if I sound totally clueless on that subject. Anybody care to elaborate on who this guy is?


Him and a guy called Engels wrote what is now known as the Communist Manifesto, upon which all socialist revolution in the 20th Century was supposedly "based".

#24
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Isn't rousseau's theory more about destroying what cannot be trusted? What's he got to do with it?



Yeah I did. http://www.greendaycommunity.org/public/...

Rousseau doesn't like civilisation and sees it as the source of all the pain humans have to go through. According to him we would be much happier if we lived in a way where we wouldn't depend on anyone('s help). I got inspired by the philosophy talking here

#25
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Rousseau doesn't like civilisation and sees it as the source of all the pain humans have to go through. According to him we would be much happier if we lived in a way where we wouldn't depend on anyone('s help). I got inspired by the philosophy talking here


Isn't that a fallacy in itself though? We are always going to need the help of others, whether we like it or not. This theory may have worked in time when there was only n hundred thousand people living in the "civilised" world, but now there are over 7 billion people living on the planet. It's not theoretically possibly for entire nations to cut themselves away.

#26
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So don't be surprised if I sound totally clueless on that subject. Anybody care to elaborate on who this guy is?


He's "the father of communisum" he wrote a book about how people should get the money they need. (that's all I really know about him we haven't got very far on our topic in history)

I think it's a great idea in theory but in practical use it's nothing, like said it caused horrible events in human history, so I wouldn't say it's a good idea at all...

#27
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I don't think it can work because in a classless society without private property there is no or only little motivation to accomplish anything that's hard or dangerous because there is no reward besides your own happiness. Why would you spend years and years becoming a doctor or an engineer, if you have just as much status and property/salary/whatever/none of that as someone stacking shelves. You'd have to be hella passionate about your job to want to do that. Same for dangerous or tedious jobs, why would anyone try to get a job cleaning sewers, it's a shitty job (har har) and it doesn't get you any further. The economy doesn't work if you provide no monetary reward and no higher status as a motivation to do something in life.

I also think it is impossible to achieve a perfect communist society, there will always be people with lust for power and wealth and profit off of a so-called communist construction; history only proves that.
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#28
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I'm struggling to understand why everyone seems to think it's a good idea "in theory".

#29
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I'm struggling to understand why everyone seems to think it's a good idea "in theory".


I think merely just for the fact that everyone would be equal; no one would be more important than the other. That's really the only good thing I see about it, but as other people have said, it's not really fair that a doctor who spent years in school would be making the same wages as a high school drop out working at McDonalds, which is why I never see it working in today's society. People wouldn't be motivated to work as hard as they are now.

#30
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I think merely just for the fact that everyone would be equal; no one would be more important than the other. That's really the only good thing I see about it, but as other people have said, it's not really fair that a doctor who spent years in school would be making the same wages as a high school drop out working at McDonalds, which is why I never see it working in today's society. People wouldn't be motivated to work as hard as they are now.


I half understand and agree with your reason given. I just don't see what's attractive about everyone being perceived as equal, because they're not.



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